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  • Driver feels powerless

    Hi everyone,

    I've been with Wig for a fair while and now everything is starting to come together with the irons after spending time on the following threads below. These were gold for me and some of the last pieces of the wig puzzle after nearly two years.

    https://wisdomingolf.vbulletin.net/f...rills-for-this
    https://wisdomingolf.vbulletin.net/b...1-weight-shift
    https://wisdomingolf.vbulletin.net/f...and-milestones (Hogan Power Drill)

    I had a real issue with early extension, high handle and not delivering the correct lie of the irons. I realised I wasn't getting off the right hand side and was actually pushing off the right foot in the downswing causing the right hip to come around instead of the left hip going back as per the hogan power move.

    Now the irons are sound, my center is hardly moving, contact is crisp and effortless power and speed. Effort is a good 4 and velocity now a 9. Even a Ten when I do the one leg drill, the lift hip snaps up and away from the target beautifully. I'm getting the weight onto my lead leg before the completion of the backswing and it all unwinds automatically.

    Now the the driver is a different story as it seems weak, strain is a 8 and velocity a 3. I can't the feel hinge on my snuff boxes where is with an iron it's nice and pronounced. Since I can't feel the hinge, I don't have that nice effortless whip and compression. My miss is a huge slice being a RH golfer. I feel my body out races the club head and it's taking forever to get to the ball. I just can't get it to all unwind around that posted lead leg like I can do with the irons. The one thing I do notice about my irons is that I can feel the heads tracking through the whole swing beautifully. I feel I'm guiding or steering the driver.

    So why do you you think the is such disparity between driver and irons? I'm 41, tall, strong and flexible. Driver swing is around 104mph, a straight drive used to go 230 meters (260 yards) carry.

    Damon
    Last edited by Damon; 4 weeks ago.

  • #2
    Hi guys,
    Another something from my former life.....
    Still think it's relevant?

    dude abides



    Copyright 2010 March 27, 2010
    +/- 889 words
    One Time Rights

    Bill McCabe

    Email:


    “Manly Man” and Yardage Windows
    or
    Centrifugal Force; Not Brute Force


    Have you ever been “in the Zone”? Not necessarily in golf, but in any aspect of your life? Maybe you had a particularly good run of meetings at the office in which you were particularly persuasive and effective at getting the team to go along with your ideas. You were prepared and confident; and it showed. Work was fun. It was easy.

    Perhaps in your personal life? Every stranger with whom you struck up a conversation found you engaging and witty; fun to be around. You were having unusual success with the ladies? Welcome to the “Zone”.

    It happens in athletics too. You drain three-pointer after three-pointer; almost effortlessly. You’re making every correct pass without thinking about it. Your teammates can sense that if they get open you will find a way to get them the ball. Every pool shot goes in; even the tricky combinations and bank shots. You’re focused and nothing seems to distract you.

    In golf? Every tee shot splits the middle of the fairway. You KNOW that your approach will find the green. Every putt seems to go in. You feel a sense of calm confidence that you have “It” today. Have you ever been there? I would say that you were feeling pretty good about yourself, but you weren’t thinking about that until after that visit to “the Zone” had passed. While you were in it, your Ego was on some sort of auto-pilot.

    Do you have trouble with the Driver? Do you find that your level of efficiency and consistency with your other clubs is greater than it is with your Driver? I did too, once, until I learned about the influence your Ego can have on your golf game. Ego in golf can be a good thing and a bad thing; depending upon how you let it affect you.

    The good thing is when you think in terms like “confidence” or “success”. The bad thing is when you become concerned with your self-esteem or your self-image. We all go through phases where we equate how HARD and how FAR we hit the driver with our self-image; our EGO. I call it the “Manly Man Complex”. It’s a disease. The harder and farther you hit the ball, the more “manly” you are. Rubbish.

    Let me ask you a question. Picture yourself in the bar after your round. You’re having a drink with your buddies and you get to “brag” about some aspect of your game today. Would you rather brag about the LONG DRIVE(S) you hit or the LOW SCORE you shot? To a man, everyone to whom I’ve posed this question over the years has answered “the low score”. To which I’ve responded: “Rubbish…then PLAY that way?”

    What club do you hit from 150 yards? Ask any reasonably experienced golfer and he/she can recite that number precisely. For purposes of this discussion we’ll presume 7-iron. So when you’re out on the course and faced with a 150 yard shot, you confidently pull your 7-iron, right? Well what if you were looking at a shot of one hundred and EIGHTY yards? Easy; you’d swing really HARD with your seven-iron, right? Duh, NOT RIGHT!
    You’d “club up” a bit; perhaps 5-iron.

    That’s because you have long ago decided that each of your clubs has a “distance window”, beyond which it is foolishness to attempt to hit it. Well, here’s the deal. Your DRIVER has a DISTANCE WINDOW just like the rest of your clubs. Trying to hit the ball BEYOND that window is just as foolish as trying to hit your wedge 200 yards. But, with the Driver we do it all the time, don’t we?

    Notice at this point that I didn’t ask you how far you hit the driver? That’s because most of us don’t know, and if we DO know, we’ll exaggerate. No, let’s call it like it is: we’ll LIE! That’s our EGO taking over. We watch the guys on TV blast it over 300 yards and we have fooled ourselves into thinking that 300 is normal. HELLO?!?! We can’t hit it as far as those guys do and the quicker we get back to reality, the better.

    Remember distance comes from speed, and trying to hit the ball HARDER will invariably SLOW your swing down; not speed it up.

    While we’re talking about your Driver, take a look at the face loft and shaft flex of the one in your bag. Most commonly, especially amongst players who profess to have difficulty with the driver, they are playing a stick with too stiff a shaft and not enough loft on the face. Somehow, we’ve come to equate stiff shaft and low face loft with Manly Man. “…I swing really hard so I need an extra stiff shaft…”?!?! I hear it all the time. That’s your Ego talking again; not reality. In most cases, a “softer” shaft (closer to “Regular”) and more loft on the face will do way more to help maximize distance for the majority of players.

    Now this discussion is a generalization and not intended to be a substitute for professional club fitting; only to point out that letting your ego get in the way of your Driver specs and swing is robbing you of the very thing that you are attempting to attain. Remember, distance results from speed, and speed results from Centrifugal Force; not BRUTE force.
    "OLD" Forum Participation

    Entry Date: 18-JAN-2011
    Posts: 1813
    Thank You: 1048

    "Be water, my friends"

    Comment


    • Ferko
      Ferko commented
      Editing a comment
      You really need to publish a blog with all this stuff. My 0.02€.

  • #3
    That's a terrific read and something I think most golfers have been guilty of. I think this issue calls for a reset, Shawn has mentioned only recently to reset an out of balance washing machine swing, try the 150 yard driver swing.

    Comment


    • #4
      The shaft should be perceived as a piece of string during release (not a lever).

      The clubhead should be perceived as a free moving mass through ball to target during release.

      Comment


      • #5
        Originally posted by Damon View Post
        Now the the driver is a different story as it seems weak, strain is a 8 and velocity a 3. I can't the feel hinge on my snuff boxes where is with an iron it's nice and pronounced. Since I can't feel the hinge, I don't have that nice effortless whip and compression. My miss is a huge slice being a RH golfer. I feel my body out races the club head and it's taking forever to get to the ball. I just can't get it to all unwind around that posted lead leg like I can do with the irons. The one thing I do notice about my irons is that I can feel the heads tracking through the whole swing beautifully. I feel I'm guiding or steering the driver.
        I have the same issue but the other way round (wood is fine but irons are not). Schrodinger said above that

        the shaft should be perceived as a piece of string during release (not a lever) and the clubhead should be perceived as a free moving mass through ball to target during release.
        I'm thinking right now that the arms should also be perceived as a piece of string and the hands should be perceived as a free moving mass. Maybe that's what make you feel the snap as Shawn explained well in this great video (I confess I bought a baton ;-)).

        Comment


        • Schrodinger
          Schrodinger commented
          Editing a comment
          "I'm thinking right now that the arms should also be perceived as a piece of string and the hands should be perceived as a free moving mass".

          Yes , this is a good point and maybe the 'string(s)' have to be the ACU, especially in the 'release' stage. The 'free moving masses' would be equivalent to COG of the arms, the COG of the hands and the COG of the club. It sort of reminds be of that compound pendulum illustration on 'golf loopy' again but where the fulcrum would be the sternum notch.


          http://cloud2.golfloopy.com/wp-conte...dulum-1020.gif

      • #6
        I always thought the weight shift is at the end of the swing, you do it while the backswing is still not finished! Okay, I am going out to the shed to practise.

        Comment


        • #7
          I always feel with my irons is that the arms and club are one unit, joined by a greasy flexible universal joint, speaking of the mechanical world, the joint being the wrists. I just don't feel that sensation with the driver, probably because of the length and the fact it's out in front dung the swing compared to up and under as in the irons. At the moment I'm swinging my irons completely with the lower body and I can all but forget about arm club Uni joint unit, just knowing it's going to whip through. It's a sensational feeling, just can't replicate with driver.

          Comment


          • Gary
            Gary commented
            Editing a comment
            Yes, I am currently readying “Secrets of Owning Your Swing” by EA Tischler, and “Elements Of The Swing” by Michael Jacobs.

          • Schrodinger
            Schrodinger commented
            Editing a comment
            You might be interested in my blog where I've mentioned certain tests that EA Tischler and Adams devised to check swing action patterns that might fit your body. Funny enough, when I tried to focus and throw using a 'distal' cue/target (after getting into correct posture and engaging my glutes/quads rather than calves), my natural swing pattern sort of matched the test results (approximately). So it was quite pleasing to find that applying WIG philosophy actually produced a naturally correct swing pattern for my physique.

            https://wisdomingolf.vbulletin.net/b...swing-thoughts

            PS. In the end, after many hours reading, I did understand more about the 'what' in the golf swing but it didn't help me figure out 'how'.
            Last edited by Schrodinger; 4 weeks ago.

          • Gary
            Gary commented
            Editing a comment
            EA Tischler ‘s book “Secrets Of Owning Your Swing” has helped refine my understanding of my personal biomechanics. I have read the three volumes he has published so far. He still has a fourth volume to write. All four volumes/books are about the Swinging Action/type of the golf swing. The Swinging action is about the Rotary type of swing. He also plans to write about the other two actions “Hitting” and “Throwing”.

            Tischler defines each category in accordance with their primary source of power transfer. The “Hitter’s” primary source of power is muscular thrust. For “Throwers,” it is weight shift, and “Swingers” rotation.

            A WIG golf swing is made up of a combination of all three actions. If you have a good understanding of WIG and can relate these actions as defined by Tischler to your personal golf swing then I recommend you read his book series “Secrets of Owning Your Swing”.

            Below is what I know so far about my personal
            biomechanics as defined by EA Tischler: The “*” next to each category defines me.

            Edward A. Tischler “Secrets of Owning Your Swing”

            Power3 Golf Biomechanics Related to Accuracy:
            *
            Swing Path (Forearm Action)
            On-Top
            Side-On
            Under*
            Swing Track (Elbow Action)
            Low-Track
            Mid-Track*
            High-Track
            Wrist Lever Action (Wrist Hinging)
            Horizontal
            Vertical
            Diagonal*
            Lever Delivery Action (Release)
            Covering
            Cornering
            Extending*

            Power3 Golf Biomechanics Related to Power:

            Swing Anchor (Balance Point To Pivot Around)
            Front
            Center
            Rear*
            Torque System (Multiply Power)
            Lower Body*
            Full Body
            Upper Body
            Clearing Action (Transition in Posture making room for a biomechanically sound Swing Slotting action)
            Front Hip
            Tailbone
            Rear Hip*
            Axis of Symmetry (Centralize the Rotation Of Your Upper-body)
            Sternum Line
            Center line
            Spine Line*

            Power3 Golf Biomechanics Related to Good Feel:

            Swing Linkage:
            Front Zone
            Center Zone
            Rear Zone*
            Swing Slotting:
            Hip-Plane
            Torso-Plane
            Shoulder-Plane*
            Postural Release:
            Stand-Up
            Post-Up
            Rotate*
            Arc Management:
            Narrow-Wide
            Deep-Deep
            Wide-Narrow*

            The information about me above will give your Blog a comparison of two different WIG players.

            However, it was not Tischler that defined what type of player I am. He only helped to refine those actions. I will share my experiences at a later date. Our Forum members already have a lot to digest here.

            I tried to make this comment on your blog but it prevented me from doing so. I will try and post this Information on your blog at a later date once the Forum is fixed.

        • #8
          Here are a few areas to check into.

          1. Width of Stance. Is it the same as your irons?
          2. Type of shaft used with the driver Vs the irons.
          3. Timing. Must wait for the weight. Try and hit some 150 yard shots.

          Comment


          • #9
            Thanks guys, more good reading there. I definatley feel width of stance can be an issue, too wide and I feel restriction going back so I try and have it similar to the irons which is no more than inside shoulder width. My irons are Maltby TE Forged which by the way are sensational, they possess game improvment qualities with player cavity looks, they spin great and are not like the modern low spin power bats that are all the go now for so called high handicap players. Also as a bonus they have a top line as thin as a blade and a very low Cor so if your a miss is low on the face, you don't get punished. Shafts are KBS Tour 105's which seem to be a good match, not light but not super heavy, I just love how these track in the swing.

            I put put a new driver in the bag today, a Cobra F6+, with a 67g Matrix Black Tie which the shaft is a bit of a beast on paper, but seems very steady in the backyard net, strike was consistent and first indications I could really feel where the head was in the swing on this one but the course will tell. Old driver was the Cobra Fly Z with 60g shaft' it was a good driver it just felt lost in the swing.

            Weight for the weight is huge for me the driver, I was good at it in the past but actually it must have left me for a bit. I tried it today in the net, the outcome was that I had more time to get of the RH side onto that nice solid left post and then just let it all unwind. Felt I also had more time to "push the kid at the right part of the swing" to power it and then flip the left hip around, back, away and up from target to really give the punch just like the one leg drll though not as pronounced which means I still need to work on this, I feel this may be one of the main power leaks.
            Last edited by Damon; 4 weeks ago.

            Comment

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